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Kluuz  





Joined: 28 Jun 2008
Posts: 135
Location: York, PA

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 8:19 am    Post subject: Can someone please explain... Reply with quote

How is he able to do this? I haven't played too much Blitz, so I have no idea how he's doing this. And sorry if I posted this in the wrong forum.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7Ev_ZotrB0M&feature=plcp
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TheLonging  





Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 4187

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 12:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can only infer, but:

Blitz has a pretty big timing window, so it's easy to hit two notes at once, increasing your chance of maxing out multipliers. This is easiest to do on slow/less dense songs like Buddy Holly.

Thing is, it doesn't work that well if you don't practice the technique, as you'll drop more points than gaining if you just flail around. You can hear that he has a certain rhythm going on. It really does take some practice (I'm still learning myself).

Bandmate especially helps out, as it can do a track for you while you do the other two tracks. It'll get to a certain point where it's not really all that needed to level up; by that point, the flame notes you hit will outweigh whatever you get normally by leveling up so long as you can keep it going, which is why it's easier to do it on less dense songs than, say, Spoonman.
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NavyCherub wrote:
AshleyWilis wrote:
hi for me Its something different...
It seems like Full sound full combo...
I mean It show passion and determination for my guitar
Smoke weed erryday.
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anonymous_25  





Joined: 01 Jan 1970
Posts: 0

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 1:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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TheLonging  





Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 4187

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 2:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I use Freakish, and with how big the window is, I can rack up Blitz and level up easier. It's how I got a lot of my high scores in the Leagues.
_________________
I wanna thank you for letting me be myself.

NavyCherub wrote:
AshleyWilis wrote:
hi for me Its something different...
It seems like Full sound full combo...
I mean It show passion and determination for my guitar
Smoke weed erryday.
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zage1337  





Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 432

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 6:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can get over 500k on most songs regardless what the chart is by doing this. Basically you try to hit every adjacent note you can so flames don't go out.

I never ever miss adjacent notes when they are inwards(aka a right note on guitar to a left note on vocals), but I often miss other adjacent notes.

Got kinda close to 600k on Bring Me to Life trying this lol.

BRB gonna try to beat my score on Spoonman
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MasterMo  





Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 60
Location: Kent, Ohio

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 8:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is a rather large thread about this over on the Rock Band forums. People were not too happy with me when I first explained what I do (assuming I play with no semblance of skill or finesse), but posting this video seems to have changed some people's opinion. Not everyone, but you can't win 'em all.

Basically, as TheLonging said, the timing window in Blitz is pretty large, so with the right timing you can hit a note, switch lanes, and hit an adjacent note. I primarily use it, in combination with bandmate, to hit an obscene amount of flame notes without worry of flames dropping out, but it's also useful for leveling up multiple tracks quickly and grabbing extra overdrive.

I play using a standard Xbox 360 controller on freakish. I have screwed around and played on a fight stick before, but I don't think I could do as well with it compared to a plain ol' pad. Haven't done it in a while though.
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TheLonging  





Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 4187

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm curious as to how you do it very consistently though. I can do it for a short bit, but after a few notes i just lose rhythm and fuck up.
_________________
I wanna thank you for letting me be myself.

NavyCherub wrote:
AshleyWilis wrote:
hi for me Its something different...
It seems like Full sound full combo...
I mean It show passion and determination for my guitar
Smoke weed erryday.
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MasterMo  





Joined: 09 Jan 2007
Posts: 60
Location: Kent, Ohio

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 9:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Well, it's just as you said: practice. I've logged 150 hours into the game playing about 800 different songs, trying to juggle lanes whenever I saw a pattern of notes where it looked possible. As time passed, I challenged myself to hit harder patterns. Now I can hit most patterns without too much trouble.

I'm still not perfect, though. Look at my video in the section right before the chorus, where drums goes right-right-right-right and so forth then switches to left-left-left-left. When those notes are on the right, I can hit the juggle pattern comfortably. But when the notes are on the left, I fall apart. That isn't just me screwing up in the video, that happens all the time. And I don't get it - it shouldn't be that much different from what I'm already able to do. Guess I just have to practice it more.
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zage1337  





Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 432

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 10:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm pretty sure it's just practice. MO practicably learned the whole game with Band/Flame and been practicing it for over 100 hours.

After a few days I'm already starting to hit adjacent notes more accurately without blitz dropping and have achieved 200k points worth of flames under 1 session(i've only pulled it off once during a song though, not every flame session). But after a short amount of time with Band/Flame I can achieve 1st place scores with it and beat some of my scores that I achieved with jack/flame and even pinball which I have far more practice on. Got over 500k on the Evanescence songs which I could never do with other playstyles.

I do think the band/flame combo is overpowered(overpowered being an understatement, try game breaking) and wish HMX would buff the other powerups a bit more to counter some of these astronomical scores.

I can not even come close to that level of play to what he did in those videos though, but honestly it just comes down to practice and muscle memory. You don't even need to hit every note accurately every time unlike Jackpot/Flame.

MasterMO wrote:
But when the notes are on the left, I fall apart. That isn't just me screwing up in the video, that happens all the time. And I don't get it - it shouldn't be that much different from what I'm already able to do. Guess I just have to practice it more.


I have the same problem when the drum note is a left note and the bass note is a right note(or any combination of outer adjacent notes) I can never hit those patterns without blitz dropping and this is why I fail horribly at Tempted when that pattern is non stop, and I don't get it either because I can hit other adjacent notes, especially inward ones (left on drums, right on bass for example) 100% of the time.
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JCirri  





Joined: 04 Feb 2006
Posts: 4575

PostPosted: Thu Dec 13, 2012 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm the same way in terms of being able to hit "inward" adjacent squeezes just about 100% of the time and being less consistent with others. I've improved my accuracy on other combinations by making a conscious effort to pay attention to button order. At first I was trying to increase the speed of the motion, but upon closer examination realized I was missing due to hitting the second note slight before changing lanes, and slowing down helped a lot. With inward squeezes you switch hands after the lane change which makes for a much more natural movement. I play with the standard control scheme and find it's also easier to press my thumb quickly followed by my index finger on the same hand (inward squeezes) than the reverse.

Since making that conscious effort I rarely miss on "outward" squeezes now, but I'm still not as consistent as I'd like to be with left-left or right-right squeezes. I'm often a bit too slow or still hit the second note before changing lanes when all 3 button presses are on the same hand (especially left-left with my left hand).

I still prefer Jackpot/Flame, but for a while I've been working in and practicing adjacent squeezes regardless what I use. At the end of songs I often attempt triple squeezes for fun and hit them occasionally. So I do understand how it's possible to reach the point that MasterMo has demonstrated, especially if that's the playstyle practiced from the start.

It is a bit disappointing that other combinations rarely can compete with this for 4-part songs, though I still wouldn't say it's optimal as keeping a single pinball alive for an entire song would likely be better as seen from 1-track songs. While I think it's unlikely right now, one day someone may develop excellent pinball skills and one-up this technique.

The more disappointing fact is that the reward for playing the game as intended (hitting notes / keeping combo) is far outweighed by things like hitting all flames at any cost (even with button mashing) and keeping a pinball alive (even ignoring all notes on screen).

I will admit that it's hurt my interest level knowing that at least someone out there is probably practicing button mashing on band/flame and that may be all we see at the top of the 4-part leaderboards one day (including on songs where it's humanly impossible to legitimately juggle the squeezes). Even if it's inferior score-wise I'll only ever work towards improving my techniques while attempting to play the rhythm the songs provide.
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TheLonging  





Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 4187

PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yeah, I mean going for scores, that's something you can't beat, but in terms of pure fun, I tend to stay away from Bandmate (Flames can be fun but only when using Jackpot). I've actually been replaying songs where I've used Bandmate/Flame to enjoy the feeling of playing the game as is intended.

I think either, for future Blitz games, if there will be such a thing, removing the bandmate or finding a way to make Flame not as overpowered as it is now.
_________________
I wanna thank you for letting me be myself.

NavyCherub wrote:
AshleyWilis wrote:
hi for me Its something different...
It seems like Full sound full combo...
I mean It show passion and determination for my guitar
Smoke weed erryday.
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zage1337  





Joined: 20 Nov 2008
Posts: 432

PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I might be having the exact same problem as JCirri, and yes it's saddening that people might resort to button mashing like what Magnet demostrated just to achieve high scores. I won't ever be doing that because I don't want to break my controller and it's also not fun at all to do. I hope HMX does something to prevent people from cheating the leaderboards doing the cheap move that Magnet showed on Buddy Holly.

I actually find band/flame kinda fun if you are actually trying to hit all the notes you can though. I still like Bottle Rocket and Pinball and those powerups don't get enough love.
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TheLonging  





Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 4187

PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

MasterMO is doing it, although I wouldn't be surprised if Magnet does it too. It's not bad, and I have nothing against it (given that I do it myself).

I just would like to see some kind of a balancing thing. I've recently discovered how good Sync can be in certain occasions, as can Bottle Rocket and even Point Doubler (only if you're going into sections that can score you massive points but can't combo).
_________________
I wanna thank you for letting me be myself.

NavyCherub wrote:
AshleyWilis wrote:
hi for me Its something different...
It seems like Full sound full combo...
I mean It show passion and determination for my guitar
Smoke weed erryday.
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JCirri  





Joined: 04 Feb 2006
Posts: 4575

PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 1:26 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

If you're trying to hit everything and stay in blitz mode I have no problem with squeezing and wouldn't rule out using band/flame myself if I felt I could consistently manage 2 parts in a 4-part song. The sad part is that doing so takes an enormous amount of skill compared to the alternative of button mashing and for typically less reward (a perfect blitz bonus usually won't offset even one blown flame session).

If Blitz Bonus acted more as a multiplier than fixed amounts (or even if fixed amount ticks were multiplied by your current multiplier), skill would be much better reflected in scores regardless of power-up selection. But any change of that magnitude would completely change the landscape of the leaderboards, so I'm doubtful at this point.

They could try detecting spammed input and upon detection disable input for a few seconds or something, but there's a lot of fast parts where legitimate play could cross the somewhat arbitrary line.
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TheLonging  





Joined: 07 Apr 2008
Posts: 4187

PostPosted: Fri Dec 14, 2012 1:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

JCirri wrote:
They could try to detect spammed input and upon detection disable input for a few seconds or something, but there's a lot of fast parts where legitimate play could cross the somewhat arbitrary line.


Stuff like the Chaotrope songs, Cult of Personality, Sweet Home Alabama, DYFLWD, Visions, RBN Megamix 01, and others have parts that almost require spamming, depending on your setup, and as such would become frustrating and near unplayable at parts if there was a spammed input detector.

Technically, Bandmate/Flame is valid, and even endorsed in one of the power up spotlight blogs. The only way to fix it and make leaderboards fair is to balance Bandmate and/or Flame and wipe the leaderboards with 4 instrument songs that have outlier scores, but that'd be preposterous and almost unfair.
_________________
I wanna thank you for letting me be myself.

NavyCherub wrote:
AshleyWilis wrote:
hi for me Its something different...
It seems like Full sound full combo...
I mean It show passion and determination for my guitar
Smoke weed erryday.
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View user's profile Wiki User Page Send private message Visit poster's website
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