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Incorrectly charted vocals
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xtreme2252  





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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 10:41 am    Post subject: Incorrectly charted vocals Reply with quote

Beep boop, update.

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Nothing More - Fat Kid Quite possibly the worst chart anyone will ever see hit Rock Band.
Now, the intro isn't too bad ("bruised" goes the wrong way, it should start low and go high rather than vice versa. "...ease the pain" is a bit off, but still manageable), but the first part where it goes amiss is the first "NOT bad for a FAT kid", which is charted both slightly out of time and noticably off-pitch.
HERE's where things start to get really bad though. "This is our cha-ance" where the chance should start a bit lower than "our", then immediately drop down is just charted as a steady pitch instead. "Not BAD for a FAT kid" is charted a bit worse this time around as well. Now, one of THE worst phrases in the song. The "NOT BAD!" scream is charted with a high "not" followed by a screeching "BAAAAD!" (I'm not sure the actual notes, but it would be nice if someone who knows could let me know)
Now, if you get past THAT combo-breaker there, there's a short bit of decent charting, aside from an odd ".....abooooooout-oh yeah!" charting, where it's charted as a single pitch, whereas it should probably be slowly raising in pitch. Right after this part is a series of low-charted whispering which should be charted as talkies, the last of which having odd pitches.
Now, right after this part, guess what? ANOTHER screeching screaming part. "Whatchu gonna DOOOOOO!" The "do" of course, which should be a talkie, being charted at the very top.
So now the hard part is past, right? Errr....not quite. In fact, it was pretty much just the gate to vocalist hell. EVERY, and I mean EVERY phrase for the rest of the song is a pure trainwreck. If you thought the chorus couldn't get much worse, you'd be horribly mistaken. "NOT BAD for a FAT kid" has become even more spaced out in pitches, and a few phrases are painfully out of sync with the actual song,
AND ONCE AGAIN, the LAST "Not bad for a fat kid" is THE single WORST phrase in the entire song. For one, it starts way earlier than the song, two, each note is out of beat and the last half of the phrase goes way too fast, and three, the "for" is charted right at the bottom, and it's not a note that's easily guessable either. So what you'll want to do is make sure you hit the "Not" (you should be good at that by this point), drop down further than you normally would for the "bad", which is charted much lower now, either attempt to go up a bit to hit the low note, or ignore it completely and just go up a tiny bit and hold it till you hit the "a", then rush the last bit of the phrase since the notes are too short and close together.
The last few phrases of the song aren't too bad, but obviously highly chokeable.
PUSH - Low Life in the Fast Lane
Nine Inch Nails - Burn Screaming parts charted way too high. Many lyrics change pitch too sharply, especially the first phrase. Whispered "Sometimes I think it could"s charted as low pitches. "I am the angel of your destruction" onwards are charted higher than they should be, some of which should NOT even be pitches. "Secret desire" is distorted, but also should not be charted so high. "I am your future" is screaming and should have been talkies. "Swallowed up in fiiiiiiiire" however, is charted as all talkies, even though they could have very well charted a screechingly high pitch in the middle of "fire" and it would have worked better than the other ones in the song.
Nine Inch Nails - March of the Pigs Screaming parts charted an octave too high and each note is too long and should probably drop a bit near the end. "Doesn't it make you feel better/ The pigs have won tonight/ They can all sleep soundly" is too spread out in pitches.
Worth noting that RB didn't use the album version of this song. The hard phrases sound like garbage in this version.
The Who - Young Man Blues (Live at Leeds) I think they charted this from sight, meaning they weren't keeping in mind the range of this song, which if I remember correctly is something like two and a half octaves, give or take. Phrases like "Well a young man" which should descend maybe half an octave, and visually look like they do, actually descend an entire octave. Assuming from the tiering, this wasn't intentional, as this is probably one of the hardest songs in the game. The high "They step...back"s near the end also do this.
Flight of the Conchords Demon Woman
Flight of the Conchords - The Most Beautiful Girl (In the Room) Now, it is possible to get through this and sound decent, but there are many phrases near the beginning which are, in my opinion, overcharted (especially "When you're on the street"). The notes are too spaced out. Also, there's some odd switches to background vocals, and merging of both vocal tracks.
As made famous by Iron Maiden - The Number of the Beast"
As made famous by Iron Maiden - Run To the Hills (RB1)
The Konks - 29 Fingers Final phrase drops further than it should
KMFDM - Juke Joint Jezebel The pitches in the chorus parts are way too spaced out and they're not even remotely accurate.
The Strokes - Reptilia Call me crazy, but this chart does not look nor sound right.
Nine Inch Nails - The Perfect DrugSome oddness with octave charting. I'll assume the whispering at the start is too low, and the high-pitched phrase is also too low. Also, there's pitch-charted whispering in the middle of the song.
Fake Shark-Real Zombie! - Angel Lust Verses go too deep. Chorus could use some tweaking
System of a Down - B.Y.O.B. Extremely half-assed charting. Pitches are simplified throughout, and charting switches between Serj and Daron on a dime with no rhyme or reason, and is very inconsistent throughout.
The Vines - Outtathaway
Death of the Cool - Can't Let Go "I know it" (x3) is somewhat whispered. Also worth noting a minor lyrics mistake, "in our heart" instead of "in the heart."
Mastodon - Colony of Birchmen"Run....with/ Death" charted as a 3 note step (Deh-ehh-eath), rather than (bear with me) "dehh-ee-EHH-eath"
TRUST Company - Downfall Charting blatant screaming parts as high pitches.
Otep - Smash the Control Machine Simply lots of incorrect pitches here and there, especially at the fast phrases (timing seems to be off too).[/url]
Queens of the Stone Age - Sick, Sick, Sick[/b]
Ministry - The Great Satan Although I think this is as accurate pitch as you can get from those screams, I dont think its possible to scream this song accurately and combo it, especially not the Great Satan parts.
Jimi Hendrix - Fire Low "Fire" (1:00) is charted too low.
Good Charlotte - Girls & Boys The Middle on crack. Correct notes charted an octave too low being mixed together with pitches charted in the correct octave.
Razorlight - Stumble and Fall "Nothing at all"s are charted way too low.
Say It Ain't So 2:17 Uncharted pitch.
Megadeth - Take No Prisoners The charting of the parts Dave is whispering under the backup vocals are questionable.
Stone Temple Pilots - Vasoline Many people have told me theres a phrase in this song (I think its the first one) where the word at the end is charted too deeply. I didnt really notice, personally.
Red Hot Chili Peppers Dani California
Possible songs to be considered
California Uber Alles
Holiday In Cambodia
I Bleed
I Get By 2:01
Ladybug 0:26
Learn To Fly
Little Sister
One Step Closer
PDA
Fake Shark-Real Zombie! - Sestri Levante
Sleepwalker
Ted, Just Admit It... 2:43
They're Red Hot

Octave weirdness:
A-Ha - Take On Me 3:37
Flobots - Handlebars 3:10
Stone Sour - Made of Scars
Stone Sour Through Glass
Red Hot Chili Peppers - Under the Bridge 3:44
Stroke 9 - Kick Some Ass '09
System of a Down - Toxicity

Blatant misuse of talkies
Electric Six Gay Bar
Foo Fighters Monkey Wrench
The Pixies I Bleed
The Pixies Mr. Grieves

Lazy charting
Nine Inch Nails The Hand That Feeds
Nine Inch Nails Head Like a Hole

Uncharted vocal sections
Disturbed Down with the Sickness
The Pixies I Bleed
R.E.M. Orange Crush
Those are not Vocals
Seppuku with a Straw Death by Cancer
Phrase separation in RB3
Bon Jovi Livin On a Prayer


Last edited by xtreme2252 on Thu May 15, 2014 6:51 pm; edited 22 times in total
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Hobo111  





Joined: 27 Dec 2009
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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If one phrase is weird, it doesn't make it a bad chart. <_< The only really bad ones I see on this list is B.Y.O.B and Fat Kid.
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anonymous_25  





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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 2:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

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TheCustodian  





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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 4:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

In "Henrietta" and "Jesus Christ Pose," they're charted that way because that's what the singer's singing. The low bits in JCP are mostly the same melody as before, but lower. "Henrietta" does have "random gibberish," but there are pitches in there.

Oh, and in "Waiting for the End," you're singing a harmony part. It's not meant to follow the main line.
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machetemonkey  





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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

TheCustodian wrote:
In "Henrietta" and "Jesus Christ Pose," they're charted that way because that's what the singer's singing. The low bits in JCP are mostly the same melody as before, but lower. "Henrietta" does have "random gibberish," but there are pitches in there.

Oh, and in "Waiting for the End," you're singing a harmony part. It's not meant to follow the main line.


Yeah. Henrietta's random gibberish (I believe) follows the guitar part, pitch wise.

Also, I know BYOB is generally considered bad, but if GHWT "copied" the chart (which I know they wouldn't have, since I doubt they cracked open the DLC files and pulled out those pitches a month before GHWT was released), then has anyone considered that it might actually be correct in some way, or at least the best they can do (maybe the stems are strange or something)?
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Icemage  





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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 4:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

B.Y.O.B.'s chart isn't "that" bad from a pitch standpoint aside from a couple of places where un-autotuned screams get charted as pitches (for the counter-argument to this, see Downfall by TrustCompany).

My issue with B.Y.O.B. is the same issue I have with Money For Nothing's chart in GHWoR on vocals; unintuitive and haphazard switching from lead to harmony vocals.

Quick comments on the other songs on the list:

Burn (NIN): This is definitely the biggest offender in terms of "these should have been talkies". Most of the spoken verses (esp. the first phrase) should not have been charted as pitched.

The Perfect Drug: I don't have a problem with octave-shifted charting, but the whispery phrases absolutely should have been talkies. I can only assume that they were charted as pitches because the original RB1 engine couldn't make heads or tails of the raw vocal track and produced unscorable phrases.

Waiting For the End: I've only played this song a couple times but you may be right; those pitched raps from Shinoda definitely didn't feel right.

A Jagged Gorgeous Winter: Been a long while since I played this, but it felt charted right to me; might depend on which voice you're "tuned in" to.

Lazy Eye: Actually the screamy section IS up an octave than the rest of the song, so I don't quite see the criticism here.

Gimme Shelter: Mick Jagger just isn't singing completely on key. The female part is correctly charted throughout the song - you might object to the switching back and forth, but the notes themselves are charted correctly.
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WhYYZ  





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PostPosted: Sat May 07, 2011 5:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Icemage wrote:

My issue with B.Y.O.B. is the same issue I have with Money For Nothing's chart in GHWoR on vocals; unintuitive and haphazard switching from lead to harmony vocals.


This.
That's the only reason B.Y.O.B feels weird. I would really love a RB3 version of that song though.
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zage1337  





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PostPosted: Sun May 08, 2011 4:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Under the Bridge. The "under the bridge downtown" are charted in the same octave as the rest of the chorus despite being an octave higher.

Also the verses for that song sound really off, when I try to sing that song from how I remember it I do awful on that song, unless I am really looking at the pitch lines. The verses just seem mis charted.
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tidus  





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PostPosted: Mon May 09, 2011 10:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

zage1337 wrote:
Under the Bridge. The "under the bridge downtown" are charted in the same octave as the rest of the chorus despite being an octave higher.

I don't really consider it "mischarting", as long as it's the same notes - the song spams almost 3 octaves, from F#2 to G5, so all of Kiedis' lead part was charted one octave above to "compress" the chart and make it readable.

Furthermore, the lowest note in the "Under the bridge downtown" is a D5, and the highest note that Kiedis hits in the lead is an E4, so that would make almost one unused octave in the song.

At least, that's what I think they thought when charting "Under the Bridge".

P.S.: B.Y.O.B? Well, I never ever had any problem with the chart on GHWT. (I can even FC the song on demand), and from what I saw in the VoxData (can't get DLC), the RB chart wasn't really copied - the latter is more pitched. But whatever...
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But yeah, lol @ the fact that you can say "she" in this thread and not be sure which person is being talked about. Now we know whose milkshake brings all the girls to the yard.
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RushJunkie3  





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PostPosted: Tue May 10, 2011 7:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

zage1337 wrote:
Under the Bridge. The "under the bridge downtown" are charted in the same octave as the rest of the chorus despite being an octave higher.

Also the verses for that song sound really off, when I try to sing that song from how I remember it I do awful on that song, unless I am really looking at the pitch lines. The verses just seem mis charted.


Yeah, the low notes of the verses definitely aren't correct, or they are too low to get the pitch. I think they should have been talkies, but you can get by FCing without singing those words 100% on, so I guess it isn't too big a deal.
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Wooffus  





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PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 9:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

How can you guys bring up bad vocal charts without bringing up Detroit Rock City? Actually that's a little extreme but I still think the "get up"s and "get down"s should've been pitched instead of charted as talkies. Still just my two cents.

There's also another one in mind and that's One Armed Scissor, namely in the second verse - the "Unknown, unknown" part at the end was horribly mischarted - I have a keen ear and have listened to the original recording multiple times but I didn't see THAT kind of held note in it.

In addition, the wrong held note was also charted in the intro to "The Mountain Song" - it's meant to be a held E note, not a B. It just felt uncomfortable to me, that's all :\
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xtreme2252  





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PostPosted: Mon May 23, 2011 12:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wooffus wrote:
How can you guys bring up bad vocal charts without bringing up Detroit Rock City? Actually that's a little extreme but I still think the "get up"s and "get down"s should've been pitched instead of charted as talkies. Still just my two cents.

There's also another one in mind and that's One Armed Scissor, namely in the second verse - the "Unknown, unknown" part at the end was horribly mischarted - I have a keen ear and have listened to the original recording multiple times but I didn't see THAT kind of held note in it.

In addition, the wrong held note was also charted in the intro to "The Mountain Song" - it's meant to be a held E note, not a B. It just felt uncomfortable to me, that's all :\


For One Armed Scissor they reverse-B.Y.O.B.'d it. They copied GH's chart pitch for pitch
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mav1  





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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 12:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I find that e-pro from rb2 by beck is not correctly charted. It sounds like he is rapping and the pitches just seem off the way rb2 charted it.
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Geeoff  





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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 1:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The very first phrase in Vasoline is completely fucked up.
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tidus  





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PostPosted: Tue May 24, 2011 11:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mav1 wrote:
I find that e-pro from rb2 by beck is not correctly charted. It sounds like he is rapping and the pitches just seem off the way rb2 charted it.

If I recall correctly, E-Pro is sang slightly off-key.

Also, it's always good to remember that not every rapping section is worthy of being charted as all-talkies. E-Pro is an example of it, as well as, say, What I Got, from GH5, which is another example of songs where the vocalist is both rapping AND singing pitches.
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sentimentalgeek wrote:
But yeah, lol @ the fact that you can say "she" in this thread and not be sure which person is being talked about. Now we know whose milkshake brings all the girls to the yard.
<3 this.

| 57 RB1 on-disk FC's, plus 4 RB Vox FGFC's. No way I don't feel accomplished! =)
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